So there are multiple people in this thread who state their job is to unfuck what the LLMs are doing. I have a family member who graduated in CS a year ago and is having a hell of a time finding work, how would he go about getting one of these “clean up after the model” jobs?
I’ve been an engineer for over a decade and am now having a hard time finding work because of this LLM situation so I can’t imagine how a fresh graduate must feel.
It was. Wall St is destroying it, along with everything else in its insatiable drive for more profit. Everything must be sacrificed to the golden idol.
It makes me so mad that there are CS grads who can’t find work at the same time as companies are exploiting the H1B process saying “there aren’t enough applicants”. When are these companies going to be held accountable?
This is in no way new. 20 years ago I used to refer to some job postings as H1Bait because they’d have requirements that were physically impossible (like having 5 years experience with a piece of software <2 years old) specifically so they could claim they couldn’t find anyone qualified (because anyone claiming to be qualified was definitely lying) to justify an H1B for which they would be suddenly way less thorough about checking qualifications.
Yeah companies have always been abusing H1B, but it seems like only recently is it so hard for CS grads to find jobs. I didn’t have much trouble in 2010 and it was easy to hop jobs for me the last 10 years.
No idea, but I am not sure your family member is qualified. I would estimate that a coding LLM can code as well as a fresh CS grad. The big advantage that fresh grads have is that after you give them a piece of advice once or twice, they stop making that same mistake.
What’s this based on? Have you met a fresh CS graduate and compared them to an LLM? Does it not vary person to person? Or fuck it, LLM to LLM? Calling them not qualified seems harsh when it’s based on sod all.
The difficult part is going to be that new engineers are not generally who people think about to unfuck code. Even before the LLMs junior engineers are generally the people that fuck things up.
It’s through fucking lots of stuff up and unfucking that stuff up and learning how not to fuck things up in the first place that you go from being a junior engineer to a more senior engineer. Until you land in a lofty position like staff engineer and your job is mostly to listen to how people want to fuck everything up and go “maybe let’s try this other way that won’t fuck everything up instead”
Tell your family member to network, that’s the best way to get a job. There are discord servers for every programming language and most projects. Contribute to open source projects and get to know the people.
Build things, write code, open source it on GitHub.
Drill on leet code questions, they aren’t super useful, but in any interview at least part of the assessment is going to be how well they can do on those.
There are still plenty of places hiring. AI has just made it so that most senior engineers have access to a junior engineer level programmer that they can give tasks to at all time, the AI. So anything you can do to stand out is an advantage.
Answer is probably the same as before AI: build a portfolio on GitHub. These days maybe try to find repos that have vibe code in them and make commits that fix the AI garbage.
My path was working for a consulting firm (Accenture) for a few years, making friends with my clients, and then jumping to freelance work a few years later when I can get paid my contract rate directly rather than letting Accenture take a big chunk of it.
No idea, but I am not sure your family member is qualified. I would estimate that a coding LLM can code as well as a fresh CS grad. The big advantage that fresh grads have is that after you give them a piece of advice once or twice, they stop making that same mistake.
For a couple of hundred lines of code, they might even be above average. When you split that into a couple of files or start branching out, they usually start to struggle.
after you give them a piece of advice once or twice, they stop making that same mistake.
That’s a damn good observation. Learning only happens with re-training and that’s wayyy cheaper when done in meat.
So there are multiple people in this thread who state their job is to unfuck what the LLMs are doing. I have a family member who graduated in CS a year ago and is having a hell of a time finding work, how would he go about getting one of these “clean up after the model” jobs?
I’ve been an engineer for over a decade and am now having a hard time finding work because of this LLM situation so I can’t imagine how a fresh graduate must feel.
Has he tried being a senior developer? He should really try being a senior developer.
He needs at least a decade of industry experience. That helps me find jobs.
It would be nice if software development were a real profession and people could get that experience properly.
It was. Wall St is destroying it, along with everything else in its insatiable drive for more profit. Everything must be sacrificed to the golden idol.
It makes me so mad that there are CS grads who can’t find work at the same time as companies are exploiting the H1B process saying “there aren’t enough applicants”. When are these companies going to be held accountable?
Never, they donate to get the politicians reelected.
This is in no way new. 20 years ago I used to refer to some job postings as H1Bait because they’d have requirements that were physically impossible (like having 5 years experience with a piece of software <2 years old) specifically so they could claim they couldn’t find anyone qualified (because anyone claiming to be qualified was definitely lying) to justify an H1B for which they would be suddenly way less thorough about checking qualifications.
It’s so much worse than it was. AIs have absolutely murdered entry-level positions
Yeah companies have always been abusing H1B, but it seems like only recently is it so hard for CS grads to find jobs. I didn’t have much trouble in 2010 and it was easy to hop jobs for me the last 10 years.
Now, not so much.
After they fill up on H1B workers and find out that only 1/10 is a good investment.
H1B development work has been a thing for decades, but there’s a reason why there are still high-paying development jobs in the US.
No idea, but I am not sure your family member is qualified. I would estimate that a coding LLM can code as well as a fresh CS grad. The big advantage that fresh grads have is that after you give them a piece of advice once or twice, they stop making that same mistake.
Where is this coming from? I don’t think an LLM can code at the level of a recent cs grad unless it’s piloted by a cs grad.
Maybe you’ve had much better luck than me, but coding LLMs seem largely useless without prior coding knowledge.
What’s this based on? Have you met a fresh CS graduate and compared them to an LLM? Does it not vary person to person? Or fuck it, LLM to LLM? Calling them not qualified seems harsh when it’s based on sod all.
The difficult part is going to be that new engineers are not generally who people think about to unfuck code. Even before the LLMs junior engineers are generally the people that fuck things up.
It’s through fucking lots of stuff up and unfucking that stuff up and learning how not to fuck things up in the first place that you go from being a junior engineer to a more senior engineer. Until you land in a lofty position like staff engineer and your job is mostly to listen to how people want to fuck everything up and go “maybe let’s try this other way that won’t fuck everything up instead”
Tell your family member to network, that’s the best way to get a job. There are discord servers for every programming language and most projects. Contribute to open source projects and get to know the people.
Build things, write code, open source it on GitHub.
Drill on leet code questions, they aren’t super useful, but in any interview at least part of the assessment is going to be how well they can do on those.
There are still plenty of places hiring. AI has just made it so that most senior engineers have access to a junior engineer level programmer that they can give tasks to at all time, the AI. So anything you can do to stand out is an advantage.
Answer is probably the same as before AI: build a portfolio on GitHub. These days maybe try to find repos that have vibe code in them and make commits that fix the AI garbage.
You really think that using GitHub falls in the usual vibecoding toolbox? As in: would they even know where/how to look?
You think vibe coders don’t love the smell of their own shit enough to show it to the world?
My path was working for a consulting firm (Accenture) for a few years, making friends with my clients, and then jumping to freelance work a few years later when I can get paid my contract rate directly rather than letting Accenture take a big chunk of it.
I am so sorry…
It was a wild ride
No idea, but I am not sure your family member is qualified. I would estimate that a coding LLM can code as well as a fresh CS grad. The big advantage that fresh grads have is that after you give them a piece of advice once or twice, they stop making that same mistake.
For a couple of hundred lines of code, they might even be above average. When you split that into a couple of files or start branching out, they usually start to struggle.
That’s a damn good observation. Learning only happens with re-training and that’s wayyy cheaper when done in meat.