Or, they could focus on making their flights as comfortable and stress free as possible, make flying a pleasure again, and fewer loonies will lose it. Imagine if we all had a good experience flying?
Ticket prices originally used to be fixed by the goverment, which made airlines try to offer the best experince as a way to attract customers. But then lobbyists chanted “deregulation” enough times and airlines could set their own prices. Which of course started a race to the bottom where the way to attract customers was now to slash costs. It’s a big reason how back in the 50s being a commercial airline pilots or flight attendent was prestigious profession, became today where most of a flight crew, pilot included, qualify for SNAP.
I’m not exactly a deregulation fan, but this race to the bottom also democratized access to air travel. When the prices were fixed, they weren’t exactly fixed at anything near the cheap prices we have now (when adjusted for inflation).
Yeah exactly, people talk about how flying used to be so glamorous like it’s somehow not the same as international first class is today. I walked through the first class section on a transatlantic flight once and they had fully reclining lazy boy style seats with blankets and nice food/booze. All the seats were staggered so they could fully recline and had privacy screens you could draw shut. But those tickets are thousands of dollars, like $1000-$1500/hour of flight time at minimum, if you want to spend 20k USD you can basically cross the ocean in a flying hotel.
With all due respect, what the hell are you talking about? Flying has never been “a pleasure”. Back in the 70’s it was basically low altitude turbulence all the way from point A to point B, in a tube full of cigarette smoke.
Planes have only gotten more comfortable over time. Higher altitudes mean smoother and faster trips. Better cabin pressurization has made physical side effects of flying, like gastric issues, headaches, and fatigue far less of a problem. Better rules and processes have been introduced to make the flight nicer and safer. Seat size and leg space can be pretty limited, but I’ve never encountered anything completely unacceptable in my many times flying.
I think it’s obvious what the problem is: Americans. We fucking suck. Planes are the same all over the world, and yet America has the lion’s share of the nightmare passenger stories, because we have an attitude problem.
This was a 2h40m flight from Dallas to Charlotte. I don’t think you can blame the plane for this passenger’s downright animalistic attitude towards airline staff during a short flight.
Seat size and leg space can be pretty limited, but I’ve never encountered anything completely unacceptable in my many times flying.
Tell me you’re under six feet tall without telling me you’re under six feet tall.
The headrests don’t hit my head, my knees are jammed into the seat in front of me, the tray table sits directly on my thighs, and if I get a leg cramp I just have to sit there in pain because I can’t straighten my legs or stand up straight in the cabin. But the good news is I can see everything everyone in front of me is doing on their screens.
Honestly I’d be happier in a coffin in the cargo hold.
Yeah, I hear you. The worst is those damn non-adjustable headrests digging into your back. Cant put the tray table down flat because my knees are there and can’t move my knees because there’s no place else for my legs to go
You’re right but wrong about how comfortable flying used to be.
Flying used to be heavily regulated and was heavily subsidized by air mail contracts. Aircraft were roomier and much more comfortable. After some trust and monopoly busting, and deregulation, the loss of air mail contracts, then share holders took more control.
Then over the years prices have declined, leg room has declined, comfort has declined, passengers are now treated like sardines, being flight crew used to be a glamorous, sought-after job. We still romanticize PanAm. Now AA attendants are looking to strike because they’re making poverty wages.
You can find stories of nightmare passengers and crews from all over the world if you look, but Americans are going to hear American news.
I studied aeronautics and aviation in college. Hard to explain more from my phone while I’m pooping, but yes, flying used to be a MUCH better experience for all involved.
being flight crew used to be a glamorous, sought-after job.
lmao, yeah, do some research on how flight attendants were treated by the industry through the 90’s and tell me things are worse for flight crew today with a straight face.
Were you there? Maybe I’m looking back with rose colored glasses and with my parents taking care of all the details, but yes, flying cut rate People’s Express was a much more luxurious flight than pretty much all the “normal” airlines now. There was elbow and leg room (yes, I was almost fully grown), window passengers could see out the windows, plenty of overhead bin space and included checked bags, not overcrowded as hell, a family could get seats together without paying tons extra, much easier process dealing with security and paperwork, flight attendants that could smile and even give you the full can of soda if you were thirsty, you didn’t have to get to the airport so far ahead, you could bring your own toiletries and didn’t have to take off shoes or belts. Yes, flying even the cheapest carrier then was much better than full priced now. There’s reasons we didn’t have as many loonies
Americans. We fucking suck. Planes are the same all over the world, and yet America has the lion’s share of the nightmare passenger stories, because we have an attitude problem.
I don’t really believe this is true. I mean we Americans do suck for other reasons, but I think the reason we have more bad plane stories is because we have to fly more. You can take trains across most of Europe, but passenger trains suck in the US, and it doesn’t seem like either side of the political isle is really interested in fixing it.
From the stories online, EU has similar race to the bottom) airlines, like Ryan Air, but maybe the difference is having a national carrier that you can take pride in. In the US, pretty much all airlines are “race to the bottom” cattle cars, and the only question is whether you want a bad carrier or a worse one. Can I have British Air or Iceland Air, or Emirates Air, please?
It sure feels like this happens a hell of a lot more often now than when I was a kid back in the 80s or even a teen and young adult in the 90s. If that turns out to be statistically the case (it may just be that it’s reported on more often), it doesn’t seem like enough is being done to mitigate it.
Way way more people fly now than back then. Like 4xs as much. Things like this will also be reported basically right away and go viral. I’m sure they had unruly passengers in the past, but the increase in people flying has increased the number of shitty adults flying as well.
That option still exists, and the cost for such a luxury exists too. But you don’t fly First Class, do you? Or do you like so many other people look at the price first and pick the flight the one that costs $20 less than the next cheapest?
Relax, I do it too.
Consumers are a lot more sensitive to price than they are quality. We don’t book the $800 flight when there’s another one for $300, and then we complain about how we’re crammed into narrow seats with our knees packed against the seat in front of us. The airline that can turn a profit on a cheaper seat will fill those seats.
When I was concerned about lowest possible price, I also figured I was stuck with what I paid for.
Now I’m willing to pay a little extra. My last flight I paid for reserved seats, premium economy, and to a direct flight
But airlines have seriously raised prices here, much more than the basic seats, partly by charging for each item individually. Why do reserved seats, non-painful leg room and direct flight add $100 to my ticket? At least two of those, maybe all three, used to be basic service.
Even just charging for checked baggage is a serious issue in people’s level of frustration. I know the goal is to make more money by carrying more freight, and I don’t usually check baggage so why am I paying for other people’s baggage. However the reality is the fiasco with overhead bin space is directly related to charging for checked baggage. There are always people carrying on more than there’s space. There’s always people taking the first overhead bin since they can’t count on one near their seat. And of course half the passengers don’t seem to understand their baggage still fits if they turn it 90°. Sure people are self-centered idiots, but airlines are doing their share of making this yet one more frustrating part of air travel, by making everyone avoid checking baggage
That hideous alien creature on the wing during a storm? Me. That’s me. I saved 19 bucks on my ticket and got TWO bags of peanuts on standby! The peanuts blew away one by one somewhere over Iowa but I had beef jerky backup, as all responsible travelers do.
That guy stuffed into a 1970’s Samsonite in the unpressurized baggage hold? Also me.
One time I mailed myself through USPS. If it fits it ships flat rate!! It hurt when I got drop-kicked onto a porch though. More emotionally than anything else.
There’s no demand for that. All evidence shows that people will sacrifice pretty much everything to get a cheaper flight. I think we as a society have simply accepted that flying is a miserable experience that we put up with to get where we’re going. A few hours of suffering for an amazing week in paradise (every vacationer’s dream).
Or, they could focus on making their flights as comfortable and stress free as possible, make flying a pleasure again, and fewer loonies will lose it. Imagine if we all had a good experience flying?
Ticket prices originally used to be fixed by the goverment, which made airlines try to offer the best experince as a way to attract customers. But then lobbyists chanted “deregulation” enough times and airlines could set their own prices. Which of course started a race to the bottom where the way to attract customers was now to slash costs. It’s a big reason how back in the 50s being a commercial airline pilots or flight attendent was prestigious profession, became today where most of a flight crew, pilot included, qualify for SNAP.
I’m not exactly a deregulation fan, but this race to the bottom also democratized access to air travel. When the prices were fixed, they weren’t exactly fixed at anything near the cheap prices we have now (when adjusted for inflation).
Yeah exactly, people talk about how flying used to be so glamorous like it’s somehow not the same as international first class is today. I walked through the first class section on a transatlantic flight once and they had fully reclining lazy boy style seats with blankets and nice food/booze. All the seats were staggered so they could fully recline and had privacy screens you could draw shut. But those tickets are thousands of dollars, like $1000-$1500/hour of flight time at minimum, if you want to spend 20k USD you can basically cross the ocean in a flying hotel.
With all due respect, what the hell are you talking about? Flying has never been “a pleasure”. Back in the 70’s it was basically low altitude turbulence all the way from point A to point B, in a tube full of cigarette smoke.
Planes have only gotten more comfortable over time. Higher altitudes mean smoother and faster trips. Better cabin pressurization has made physical side effects of flying, like gastric issues, headaches, and fatigue far less of a problem. Better rules and processes have been introduced to make the flight nicer and safer. Seat size and leg space can be pretty limited, but I’ve never encountered anything completely unacceptable in my many times flying.
I think it’s obvious what the problem is: Americans. We fucking suck. Planes are the same all over the world, and yet America has the lion’s share of the nightmare passenger stories, because we have an attitude problem.
This was a 2h40m flight from Dallas to Charlotte. I don’t think you can blame the plane for this passenger’s downright animalistic attitude towards airline staff during a short flight.
Tell me you’re under six feet tall without telling me you’re under six feet tall.
The headrests don’t hit my head, my knees are jammed into the seat in front of me, the tray table sits directly on my thighs, and if I get a leg cramp I just have to sit there in pain because I can’t straighten my legs or stand up straight in the cabin. But the good news is I can see everything everyone in front of me is doing on their screens.
Honestly I’d be happier in a coffin in the cargo hold.
Yeah, I hear you. The worst is those damn non-adjustable headrests digging into your back. Cant put the tray table down flat because my knees are there and can’t move my knees because there’s no place else for my legs to go
You’re right but wrong about how comfortable flying used to be.
Flying used to be heavily regulated and was heavily subsidized by air mail contracts. Aircraft were roomier and much more comfortable. After some trust and monopoly busting, and deregulation, the loss of air mail contracts, then share holders took more control.
Then over the years prices have declined, leg room has declined, comfort has declined, passengers are now treated like sardines, being flight crew used to be a glamorous, sought-after job. We still romanticize PanAm. Now AA attendants are looking to strike because they’re making poverty wages.
You can find stories of nightmare passengers and crews from all over the world if you look, but Americans are going to hear American news. I studied aeronautics and aviation in college. Hard to explain more from my phone while I’m pooping, but yes, flying used to be a MUCH better experience for all involved.
Except for their 103rd flight.
These are decent points, but…
lmao, yeah, do some research on how flight attendants were treated by the industry through the 90’s and tell me things are worse for flight crew today with a straight face.
They’re talking about the 40s through till 1978, when we deregulated them
Were you there? Maybe I’m looking back with rose colored glasses and with my parents taking care of all the details, but yes, flying cut rate People’s Express was a much more luxurious flight than pretty much all the “normal” airlines now. There was elbow and leg room (yes, I was almost fully grown), window passengers could see out the windows, plenty of overhead bin space and included checked bags, not overcrowded as hell, a family could get seats together without paying tons extra, much easier process dealing with security and paperwork, flight attendants that could smile and even give you the full can of soda if you were thirsty, you didn’t have to get to the airport so far ahead, you could bring your own toiletries and didn’t have to take off shoes or belts. Yes, flying even the cheapest carrier then was much better than full priced now. There’s reasons we didn’t have as many loonies
Maybe I’m just physically intimidating, or a braggart, but I always get the full can of soda
The legroom may force me to drink it with my knees above my head, but still, chalk up a win for the common man
I don’t really believe this is true. I mean we Americans do suck for other reasons, but I think the reason we have more bad plane stories is because we have to fly more. You can take trains across most of Europe, but passenger trains suck in the US, and it doesn’t seem like either side of the political isle is really interested in fixing it.
From the stories online, EU has similar race to the bottom) airlines, like Ryan Air, but maybe the difference is having a national carrier that you can take pride in. In the US, pretty much all airlines are “race to the bottom” cattle cars, and the only question is whether you want a bad carrier or a worse one. Can I have British Air or Iceland Air, or Emirates Air, please?
It sure feels like this happens a hell of a lot more often now than when I was a kid back in the 80s or even a teen and young adult in the 90s. If that turns out to be statistically the case (it may just be that it’s reported on more often), it doesn’t seem like enough is being done to mitigate it.
Way way more people fly now than back then. Like 4xs as much. Things like this will also be reported basically right away and go viral. I’m sure they had unruly passengers in the past, but the increase in people flying has increased the number of shitty adults flying as well.
Not to mention everyone has a camera in their pocket whereas before no one would believe you or be able to share the story far.
That option still exists, and the cost for such a luxury exists too. But you don’t fly First Class, do you? Or do you like so many other people look at the price first and pick the flight the one that costs $20 less than the next cheapest?
Relax, I do it too.
Consumers are a lot more sensitive to price than they are quality. We don’t book the $800 flight when there’s another one for $300, and then we complain about how we’re crammed into narrow seats with our knees packed against the seat in front of us. The airline that can turn a profit on a cheaper seat will fill those seats.
I’m actually outgrowing that.
But airlines have seriously raised prices here, much more than the basic seats, partly by charging for each item individually. Why do reserved seats, non-painful leg room and direct flight add $100 to my ticket? At least two of those, maybe all three, used to be basic service.
Even just charging for checked baggage is a serious issue in people’s level of frustration. I know the goal is to make more money by carrying more freight, and I don’t usually check baggage so why am I paying for other people’s baggage. However the reality is the fiasco with overhead bin space is directly related to charging for checked baggage. There are always people carrying on more than there’s space. There’s always people taking the first overhead bin since they can’t count on one near their seat. And of course half the passengers don’t seem to understand their baggage still fits if they turn it 90°. Sure people are self-centered idiots, but airlines are doing their share of making this yet one more frustrating part of air travel, by making everyone avoid checking baggage
That hideous alien creature on the wing during a storm? Me. That’s me. I saved 19 bucks on my ticket and got TWO bags of peanuts on standby! The peanuts blew away one by one somewhere over Iowa but I had beef jerky backup, as all responsible travelers do.
That guy stuffed into a 1970’s Samsonite in the unpressurized baggage hold? Also me.
One time I mailed myself through USPS. If it fits it ships flat rate!! It hurt when I got drop-kicked onto a porch though. More emotionally than anything else.
There’s no demand for that. All evidence shows that people will sacrifice pretty much everything to get a cheaper flight. I think we as a society have simply accepted that flying is a miserable experience that we put up with to get where we’re going. A few hours of suffering for an amazing week in paradise (every vacationer’s dream).
I have had good experiences flying…to Germany. Not so much anywhere else.