In the past, if you broke or lost your phone, your Signal message history was gone. This has been a challenge for people whose most important conversations happen on Signal. Think family photos, sweet messages, important documents, or anything else you don’t want to lose forever. This explains wh...
Are people not copying their backup off their device periodically?
Personally I’d find it useful to create backups by year so the process doesn’t take twenty minutes and wouldn’t create a massive backup file.
A couple years ago I had to make an effort of sending gallery links instead of sharing images and video directly through Signal since my backup file had grown so large. It’s a bit arduous.
Are people not copying their backup off their device periodically?
Do you change your air filter, clean your keyboard, floss your teeth, derust your tools, organize your files, respond to all your messages, keep on top of available tax breaks and deals, dust under your bed etc?
No one does every random maintenance task as often as they should meaning that everyone is letting some slip occasionally which means you should expect that no, not everyone is periodically backing up and transferring their DMs to a different device.
Well my point was not that every random maintenance task under the sun gets done and ticked off a mile long list.
It seems a reasonable guess that a person whose hobby is building custom mechanical keyboards probably does keep it clean. I figured people using an encrypted messaging system with backups enabled would probably go to the trouble of ensuring those backups didn’t live in one place.
From your comment and a few others, it’s evident I was wrong in this thought. Among other things, it seems some people don’t want backups at all, which is a bit surprising to me. That’s why I asked the question.
It seems a reasonable guess that a person whose hobby is building custom mechanical keyboards probably does keep it clean. I figured people using an encrypted messaging system with backups enabled would probably go to the trouble of ensuring those backups didn’t live in one place.
The point is that encrypted messaging is not a hobby for anyone but Moxie Marlinspike. It’s just a tool that people use for communication. WhatsApp and iMessage are both encrypted and have relatively seamless backup solutions and do not require any extra thought or effort.
Is Signal equivalent in scale to iMessage or WhatsApp? Does it come preinstalled on devices as well? All three are tools, I agree, however one of these things is not like the others. The average toolbox will have Phillips and Robertson screwdrivers, but not a Torx type.
Signal takes at least a grain of interest to even get a user to install it, whereas iMessage is already there ready to go and that suits most people just fine. The question I asked was based on my incorrect assumption that centred in the Venn diagram of people whom bother to use Signal, read a technology forum, and look at an article about backups, there would also be an overlap with people that already had a backup solution in place.
Your Marlinspike comment notwithstanding, thank you for demonstrating that I was wrong. I should have remembered most people just want to drive a car, not concern themselves with how or why the wheels go round.
I’m keeping this because I really do feel like “techie” people forget that tech shit shit like back ups are a chore that 99% of people would rather not deal with.
ALL people forget that different people have different priorities and as such will “slack” where others are “diligent”. Our lives have gotten so complex that you would have a hard time finding a single person that does not slack in some areas, deemed important by some subset of society. Sport, nutrition, financial security, education, minimal tech secop, political action (atleast voting), a clean living space, clothing thats considered acceptable, an active social live and the list goes on.
So to summarize, of course “techies” forget that backups are not important to most people. Thats just normal behaviour for people in general.
I notice that a lot here on Lemmy, and I think that’s because most of us here have at least an above-average understanding of current technologies, and tend to forget that we’re a very small minority of people. So when above-average understandings are commonplace in your online bubble, your view of what an “average” understanding is can become skewed.
Frankly, it’s a bit insufferable at times. For me, Lemmy really put into focus how we all sound, myself included, at times (most of the time). We need a more diverse mix of people around here!
I agree! I think the Fediverse needs more “normies” to be present around here. Not just for the sake of having more numbers and being a more popular platform, but we need difference of opinion, and it needs to be embraced much better than it currently is.
When everybody in a community agrees on 99% of things, they tend to become rather tight-knit. But whenever that 1% comes up which goes against the flow, the reactions around here tend to be quick and harsh, and the 99% of other things you previously agreed with that person on get thrown out the window all because they don’t share the same opinion about Linux as you, or something.
It’s not a healthy pattern for a growing community.
Does having an app on the desktop PC do this for you basically? If I lost my phone today but signal was still installed on my PC. Wouldn’t that be a backup?
Then why signal? Why mention encryption as important if you offer an extra attack surface for unnecessary things… (the fight against encryption is going on anyway, but there is no need to offer an unnecessary attack surface), but there are also state trojans etc.
I’ve never backed up messages, when I do a fresh install on my phone I just go with what comes in from then on, all my chats are set to auto delete after two weeks
Are people not copying their backup off their device periodically?
Personally I’d find it useful to create backups by year so the process doesn’t take twenty minutes and wouldn’t create a massive backup file.
A couple years ago I had to make an effort of sending gallery links instead of sharing images and video directly through Signal since my backup file had grown so large. It’s a bit arduous.
Do you change your air filter, clean your keyboard, floss your teeth, derust your tools, organize your files, respond to all your messages, keep on top of available tax breaks and deals, dust under your bed etc?
No one does every random maintenance task as often as they should meaning that everyone is letting some slip occasionally which means you should expect that no, not everyone is periodically backing up and transferring their DMs to a different device.
Well my point was not that every random maintenance task under the sun gets done and ticked off a mile long list.
It seems a reasonable guess that a person whose hobby is building custom mechanical keyboards probably does keep it clean. I figured people using an encrypted messaging system with backups enabled would probably go to the trouble of ensuring those backups didn’t live in one place.
From your comment and a few others, it’s evident I was wrong in this thought. Among other things, it seems some people don’t want backups at all, which is a bit surprising to me. That’s why I asked the question.
The point is that encrypted messaging is not a hobby for anyone but Moxie Marlinspike. It’s just a tool that people use for communication. WhatsApp and iMessage are both encrypted and have relatively seamless backup solutions and do not require any extra thought or effort.
Is Signal equivalent in scale to iMessage or WhatsApp? Does it come preinstalled on devices as well? All three are tools, I agree, however one of these things is not like the others. The average toolbox will have Phillips and Robertson screwdrivers, but not a Torx type.
Signal takes at least a grain of interest to even get a user to install it, whereas iMessage is already there ready to go and that suits most people just fine. The question I asked was based on my incorrect assumption that centred in the Venn diagram of people whom bother to use Signal, read a technology forum, and look at an article about backups, there would also be an overlap with people that already had a backup solution in place.
Your Marlinspike comment notwithstanding, thank you for demonstrating that I was wrong. I should have remembered most people just want to drive a car, not concern themselves with how or why the wheels go round.
I’m keeping this because I really do feel like “techie” people forget that tech shit shit like back ups are a chore that 99% of people would rather not deal with.
ALL people forget that different people have different priorities and as such will “slack” where others are “diligent”. Our lives have gotten so complex that you would have a hard time finding a single person that does not slack in some areas, deemed important by some subset of society. Sport, nutrition, financial security, education, minimal tech secop, political action (atleast voting), a clean living space, clothing thats considered acceptable, an active social live and the list goes on.
So to summarize, of course “techies” forget that backups are not important to most people. Thats just normal behaviour for people in general.
https://xkcd.com/2501/
It does strike me as funny that some fixate on the ‘why bother’ question when viewing what amounts to be another person’s hobby.
I notice that a lot here on Lemmy, and I think that’s because most of us here have at least an above-average understanding of current technologies, and tend to forget that we’re a very small minority of people. So when above-average understandings are commonplace in your online bubble, your view of what an “average” understanding is can become skewed.
https://xkcd.com/2501/
Dammit, Im 3 hours too late.
Frankly, it’s a bit insufferable at times. For me, Lemmy really put into focus how we all sound, myself included, at times (most of the time). We need a more diverse mix of people around here!
I agree! I think the Fediverse needs more “normies” to be present around here. Not just for the sake of having more numbers and being a more popular platform, but we need difference of opinion, and it needs to be embraced much better than it currently is.
When everybody in a community agrees on 99% of things, they tend to become rather tight-knit. But whenever that 1% comes up which goes against the flow, the reactions around here tend to be quick and harsh, and the 99% of other things you previously agreed with that person on get thrown out the window all because they don’t share the same opinion about Linux as you, or something.
It’s not a healthy pattern for a growing community.
This is why I’m fine paying for iCloud backups. ducks out of the way
I’m with you, stranger!
Dives out of sight
Mind if I hang out in this void space with you until things die down out there?
Does having an app on the desktop PC do this for you basically? If I lost my phone today but signal was still installed on my PC. Wouldn’t that be a backup?
Unfortunately no, the new installation on the phone will not sync any previous chats from a desktop client.
Ah bugger, I suppose automating some sort of local/cloud/NAS backup is essential for that then.
The thing with signal on iOS is simply that there currently is no way to back up your messages.
And I’m kind of going to be a bit pissed if the only way to back up my messages will be to use signal’s servers after this feature is released.
It is weirder to me that people back shit like this up. I have zero desire to keep a backup of chat and random images people have sent me.
I’ll run a backup and restore when moving to a new device, because why not. But regular backups? Meh, the ether can have my messages if my phone dies.
That said, depending on how this new system is rolled out, I may subscribe just to support the Signal foundation.
Then why signal? Why mention encryption as important if you offer an extra attack surface for unnecessary things… (the fight against encryption is going on anyway, but there is no need to offer an unnecessary attack surface), but there are also state trojans etc.
I thought the whole point of Signal was so the messages could disappear?
I’d mostly be interested for E2E encryption.
I’ve never backed up messages, when I do a fresh install on my phone I just go with what comes in from then on, all my chats are set to auto delete after two weeks
I don’t think signal data is included in system backups unless your device is rooted. You’d have to go into signal and back it up explicitly.
I just turned this feature on. I don’t backup my device all, I just expect everything to be in my cloud.